INTERVIEW: ZIYING: FINDING WHERE YOU BELONG

This interview almost didn't happen. Let me explain why. One of my best friends and I were on our way back from Sherbrooke; happy but tired and debating if we would attend this open mic night hosted by someone I like to call a friend and one of Montreal's finest talents: Big Daddy. Why were we in Sherbrooke? Why were we exhausted? The night before, that friend and I enjoyed catching the legendary Canadian Rock band Billy Talent's performance. We stood in the pouring rain and sang our hearts out. By the end of the night, we were rusted from the rain (shit joke, if you know, you know). Please tell me you laughed or at least smiled. PLEASE! Plot twist: Our undeniable love for music and our wish to support Big Daddy overcame our tiredness. That night, we got to see a few very talented performers. One of them caught my attention instantly; her name was Ziying. Watching her perform felt like experiencing a movie scene in real-time. You know those scenes where characters are at a bar or a cafe and a mesmerizing artist is performing in front of a crowd that should be bigger. I instantly knew I wanted to sit down with Ziying and know her story. Here is my interview with a compassionate, calming, and gifted soul.  

When and how did you start singing and writing songs?

I have been singing pretty much my whole life. When I was younger, I was in choir in school. I was heavily involved in music. I was a classically trained pianist. Around when I left for university, I kind of fell out of love with classical piano because I was in a lot of competitions at the time and it was just not making me feel as fufilled as a musician. It just kind of made me feel very judged a lot of the time. I fell a little bit out of love with playing. After a few years, I decided to pick up the guitar. I had played a little bit in the past; written one or two songs in highschool for fun but nothing too serious. Around my bachelor's degree, I started experimenting more with the guitar and it really provided me with a blank slate to start on. (On piano) I had all my background experience with classical training and I felt like anything that I would create was less than what I wanted it to sound like. I couldn't execute my ideas or make my pieces sound as full as I wanted them to be. It was kind of harder to create with the piano knowing how beautiful it could sound. The guitar enabled me to have a different structure, a different format. I found that to be very refreshing. I lowered my expectations to sound a certain way, to sound full or anything. That's kind of how I started songwriting more.

You mentioned being in a choir, was it your idea?

When I was younger, it was elementary school choirs. I was heavily involved in the music department in high school. I was in band, jazz band, stage band, harmony. I was singing thoughout all of that. Only once I did more of a solo performance when I was younger. It was only in university when I was also learning a little bit more of who I was and not following what my parents established for me. I was learning who I was becoming when I really felt like I could explore that aspect of my identity through my music; a new instrument, writing new songs.

I discovered you at this open mic hosted by fellow local talent Big Daddy (back in July). When did you first start performing at open mics? How often do you perform at these types of events? What are the advantages of performing at open mics? Do you have any memorable stories to share?

I started going back in January as part of my New Year's resolutions; try to put myself out there more musically. I started with L'orbite open mic. It's my little open mic home. I feel very at home at L'orbite because I know the barista. It feels like there is a lot of creativity happening in this space. It's really community oriented. I started going to open mics there first. Then, I found a huge sense of community there; one that I knew I was missing and had not success finding in the past. I find that there was a community of creatives, of musicians that are very open to collaboration. Also, a smaller community of Asian creatives or Asian musicians who are open to collaborating. I think since the beginning of this year, I have been open, absorbing and accepting of different kinds of creative opportunities and collaboration opportunities. I often will host a potluck. I hosted a few picnics in the summertime. It's not people that I know very well but it's very nice to be in that space. I mention the Asian creative community a lot because growing up I went to francophone elementary school and high school and we were a minority. I wasn't very comfortable with how I spoke French. I was much shyer than I am now. I wasn't able to relate to people as much. There was even less of an Asian creative community. There were maybe ten Asians in the school in general. Maybe five of us were not adopted. Even I when I went to university it was hard to find a place where I belonged. I went to university in New-Brunswick. It was one of those things where I am not Chinese enough to be part of the Chinese association.

It was really hard to find a place where I belonged. It's one of those things where I am not chinese enough to be part of the association; I don't speak my language very well. My parents are immigrants. Their way of speaking Chinese changed. I also didn't feel like I had much of a community elsewhere. I was new to New-Brunswick. I was kind of starting from scratch. I didn't know how to make friends even. I had been so focused on music, school, piano competitions. I didn't have much of a social life. It was like: "Okay, now I need to discover who I am. I need to discover who are my people. I need to figure stuff and also do well academically, figure out my career." This year, I started putting myself out there more musically and everything else just came; making new friends, making new connections. It's also why I agreed to have a one on one interview and meet in person. I think it's so nice when this can happen. One of the most beautiful things that came out to going to these open mics is meeting new people and getting inspired with what they do and how passionate they are about their art. Also, seeing myself represented in other people thriving for the same things in the same kind of Asian community. I had collaboration opportunities. I got to be part of a dance and music collaboration in the beginning of June as part of FTA (Festival TransAmériques). That was lovely. I was like: "Wow, my journey has led me to perform at a festival." It was kind of an after-party thing. It was very cool. There was a lot of people. I am very grateful when these opportunities come my way.

Ziying performing, photo by Diego Nogueira (@diego.mus1c)

During that performance that night, you sang and played guitar. Do you play any other instruments? Are there any other instruments you would like to learn how to play? 

So many. I would love to learn how to play drums. I was part of a fundraiser before. I don't know if you've heard of Rock Camp for Girls. I did one of their fundraisers before where we had to get into a band, and do covers of a female or non-gender conforming artist. The group that I was put in, we decided to change instruments every song that we did. It was a lot of fun. Sometimes, I would be playing the bass, or the drums, or the keys. We were covering Céline Dion songs in a Punk Rock way. We had wigs. We had random costumes. We were trying to dress Punk Rock. I think we were probably the group who took ourselves the least serious out of all other people who were participating. It was fun because everyone knows Céline Dion songs so they were singing along.

Would you like to be part of a band at some point? 

I am part of a band. It's someone else's band. I am mostly there as a session musician. I play the keys. It's been a lot of fun. It taps into a different cultural expression through Punk Rock music. My music is usually very singer-songwriter, soft, maybe a little bit jazzy.   

You mentioned that one of your New Year's resolutions was to put yourself out there musically. Did you tell yourself: "I am going to perform every week. Once a month?"

I had myself a calendar with where there are open mics. Then, I fell in love with L'orbite and became a regular. I am a little bit less of a regular now. I haven't been keeping up. I think it's because I have been getting other gigs. That's been taking more of my time. I like to schedule going to these open mics with other people because I think we motivate each other. Also, you don't have to be 100% perfect and have all of your material figured out when you go to those. Open mics are a beautiful place where you can test out the material or present something that isn't quite all there yet. I think a lot of the times when I do go, I try to go with a buddy. I have a coworker with whom every month, we go to at least one open mic. I was going more often as well with other people.     

When it comes to writing songs, where does the inspiration come from? 

There is no one specific artist that inspires me. I think I draw from a lot of different artists. I think they inspire me in different ways. There was a time where I wanted my songwriting to be a certain way. I found that actually hindered me in my writing. I expected too much of myself; too much of what I wanted the lyrics to be or a certain level of poeticness that I wanted it to be. I talked myself out of that. I said: "You know what? I am just going to say what's on my mind. Keep it simple. I am just going to rhyme the words I want to rhyme even if they're basic; it's okay." I tried to get out of the more critical mindset that I had that I certainly inherited from playing classical piano. It brought me a lot of reassurance to think of my music as autobiographical, to think about it as a snapshot of me, where I am at a certain age, in a certain time. It's just a snapshot of where I am in my journey. It doesn't mean that when I write lyrics they have to stay those lyrics. I can have the freedom to change them as I grow older; as my creative taste changes. It helps me not to set limits to my creativity. Just to think about; acceptance of yourself; this is where you are, there is where you're meant to be and meant to sound like at this moment in time. That's okay and that's just part of your journey. That's how I write.

Is this realization recent?

I would say it has happened in the last five years. I already had that mindset for most of my originals. I often write very calming music or at least anchoring songs because it helps me ground myself when I'm on stage. I do feel a bit anxious when I go on stage and sing. It's a very vulnerable thing to do. It helps that my music is calming. It's always like a lullaby. I sing myself a lullaby and if anyone else get any kind of benefits from witnessing this lullaby then, great! I have gotten feedback: "Thank you for your music. I was stressed today. It calmed me down."

You have been performing at all kinds of events. What is next for you? (more shows and events, studio versions of your original music on streaming platforms)

I am recording for the Punk Rock band next month. So, it's not my own music but I would like to record my music eventually. I think I still struggle with judgement on myself and how I want things to sound like. I haven't quite wrapped my head around that. I just need to start and I'll be okay. I just need to try. I would very much love to have my songs on streaming platforms. I think most artists would say that their music is really for them and if other people enjoy it, then great! If other people witness it, relate to it, and like it that's just a bonus, right? In good time, it will come; the moment I record my music. Until then, I am very excited about collaborations with other people and any kind of opportunity to perform. Even if it's not my own music, I just like performing with other people.

You recently performed at the Asian Open Mic in Chinatown. How important is it to you to be part of an open mic happening in that specific part of the city?

It was really cool to be able to perform there. I had passed that temple so many times during my childhood. We would always go eat there. It was a very proud moment to show my parents. "Look, I performed in front of this park called Place Sun Yat-Sen that we passed all of the time." Chinatown has always very been homie and nostalgic for me. It reminds of my childhood for all of the food that is available there, for all of the family reunions I had over there going to Dim Sum on a Sunday with my family. Arriving in town after a long trip to Toronto and it's 2 in the morning and there is nothing open except for some Chinatown restaurants. We were tired and sleepy as kids. It made me feel like I had more of a place there. That was really really nice. I am really grateful to Claudia Chan Tak and Rich Ly who works at L'orbite for being the hosts at the Asian open mic and giving all of us that opportunity to be so visible and to have a space. As younger performers who maybe are at different levels of their musical journey to still have a platform and feel heard, seen, and validated. I think it's so important. Often times, especially with Asian families, the pressure is there to be a certain level of excellence.

On a musical level (performances, releases) what are your short-term and long-term goals? 

Short-term goals would be continuing collaborations, discovering new artists. Long-term goals would be getting funding, recording my music. I would love to be able to go on tour one day. I think that would be really cool. Recording my music and continuing to nurture this community of creatives and getting to know more of how I can contribute to the Asian community are some long-term goals. I want to be part of that community. I see something beautiful happening there and I want to be involved, help other musicians, especially Asian creatives to feel like they have a place.

You mentioned wanting to go on tour at some point, is there a specific place in the world where you would like to perform?

Honestly, I don't think there is any specific place. I think I would be just very happy to be able (and have the resources) to do that ideally with people that I really enjoy the company of and are passionate about it like I am. I have to admit that I haven't traveled the world very much. Everywhere sounds exciting to me.

I guess a tour across Canada would be a good start.

Yeah, I very much love the East Coast. I did my bachelor's degre, some of my university there. I kind of know a little bit what the vibe is. People are very nice. Maybe start with the East Coast. Start with Canada and we'll see after that.

What are some of your favourite music-related memories (a concert you attended, a performance of yours, a song you wrote) you have made?

This year, one of my favourite ones was performing for "Le festival TransAmériques" with Jimmy Trieu Phong Chung. He's a dancer. His Instagram is @jim2much. It was one of my favourites because it was my first time collaborating with a dancer and writing a song for a collaboration. It was very interesting to see how a piece that I wrote was interpreted into dance. The theme of the song was self-love. I think we really tried to nurture a space (even in our practices) where our focus was on self-love and not lose sight of it. What touched me a lot (I don't even know if he knows this) is that his family came and had not seen him perform in a while. They were so moved by the performance and were very proud. That was a really beautiful moment to witness; to be part of creating something that they would feel pride for their son. My parents are very encouraging of music. They've always said: "We don't care what you do as a career as long as you go full speed ahead in that thing and become one of the best in that field." That's still a lot of pressure. I have the chance to choose but at the same time, I have to be the best. I don't know about that. I do feel support from my parents. I don't know, it struck a chord with me to see that for another person.

I went to a Laufey concert during summer. She's an Icelandic, Chinese artist whom I believe won a Grammy this year. She's known for creating Jazz Pop music. She has grown in popularity a lot. She plays the cello, the piano, and the guitar. She has a very soothing voice. At her concert, I got to see a lot of young Asian girls dressed like her, loving her music, knowing how to pronounce her name well and feeling very represented in her music and empowered by her performance. I felt it too. I looked around the room; the person next to me was crying. I was crying too. That was another favourite memory; that Asian representation. Knowing how much her music has an impact on younger generations. I think younger generations have to know that it's okay to pursue something like music. I am lucky to be in a family where I have a choice. My parents are quite open. I know it's not the case for all families. even in my extended family, no one talks about arts being a career option. I imagine the impact that Laufey is going to have on these young girls who will consider arts as an option.

What advice would you give to other local musicians trying to get noticed?

I would say; just try and find your community of people. It makes a whole world of a difference to feel like you have a community, to feel like you know other people who are trying to do the same thing. Put yourself out there. Go to an open mic; it's a judgement free space. I think the creative community is quite supportive. I have confidence that people will get in the groove of things and will feel empowered by that community and will feel validated in what they're doing. If they don't get that reinforcement or validation in other parts or from other people in their lives; well, join our club!

Have you ever received good advice by fellow musicians?

I have received a lot of good technical advice like unlock a little bit more of my vocal technique. One of the best piece of advice that I got from Rich Ly who is one of the hosts of the Asian open mic and works at L'orbite. It was after I played at Barfly. I guess that's another one of my favourite memories and proud moments. I totally expected that show to be very noisy, not many people actually listening to me. I was sure Barfly had regular customers who come to watch tv and have a drink. A lot of friends showed up to support me. I was going in telling myself: "You know what? Lower your expectations. It's going to be fine. Just go and do your thing. Your friends are there anyway. If anything, we'll form a little bubble of support around the stage and it will be a show just for them." It was a rainy day. I remember when I started playing, I was focussing on my breath, grounding myself and it was the quietest I had ever seen Barfly get. It was so quiet, you would think you were in a cafe. I just couldn't believe my music would have such an effect. I am sure the rain outside helped. After the show, my friend Rich was there. "I am so lucky it was quiet and people were listening." He was like: "You should not be lucky. You can feel lucky but really what you should feel is pride. You should feel proud because you did that! You affected the atmosphere like that. You created that ambiance that made everyone want to listen so attentively to your music." From then on, there was a little bit of a shift in how I thought about the vibe that I create with my music. I have heard that feedback in different ways by different people. My friend Diego once told me: "It's like you create a bubble of calm, of ease, of relaxing vibes and then, people are drawn to that bubble. It's not like you are projecting it out to people. It's more that people are drawn into it. I was like: "Oh, that's an interesting way of thinking about it." I think that's very much in line with how my music feels very intimate and for myself. I am not doing it really for anyone else. If it can benefit other people, then great! I know my dad always told me: "You have a gift, you have to share it." That's also why I am like: "Okay I am going to do open mics and see how it is." I could be home and just play for myself. His words resonated with me. "You're right. I should be sharing a little bit more. Maybe, it will affect one or two people."

Ziying performing at Casa Del Popolo, photo by Diego Nogueira (@diego.mus1c)

If you could collaborate with any artist in the world, who would it be and why?

This is going to be a bit of a strange one; Awkwafina. I just think she has done so much for Asian representation. She's a rapper. That's really cool. She's just such a multidisciplinary kind of artist. I have a lot of admiration for her. She seems like a very fun person to be around. She seems very down to earth, very funny. It would be amazing to colloborate with her. I respect her a lot for her rap music back in the YouTube days, the movie "Crazy Rich Asians".

Have you seen "The Farewell"?

Yes, it reminds me so much of my relationship with my grandma. I had a really honest moment with my mom where I was like: "Mom, we gotta watch this movie." We watched it together and my mom told me: "Emily, this movie explains a lot of things that we could only hope to try to explain to you. We don't know how because of cultural differences." I grew up here with a difference culture., with a different mixture of Quebecois but also Chinese culture and values. She grew up Chinese but born elsewhere before she emigrated here (before she was a refugee). It was a really beautiful moment. I totally understand the character of Awkwafina and the right to information; all of the "Why wouldn't you tell grandma?" My mom was like:" I totally understand the other side." There is more to it than you think; the decisions that we make. Sometimes, you can just trust the process. It is for the better. We do know in a certain way. I think growing up in Canada, in this education system gets us to also be more critical of information. A lot of questions come. I am very open about asking questions to my parents like: "What's the purpose of this?" Why do we do it this way?" They don't always have the vocabulary or the knowledge to explain.

I had a really beautiful moment with my mom. We were both crying at the end of the movie and it was my third time watching it. I cried the first time I watched at the movie theater with my other Chinese friend. She was like: "This is what we try to explain but we can't."

Awkwafina is the one who popped into my mind but I am sure there is a lot of people I would want to collaborate with. I am open. I am just excited to learn.

What is your go-to karaoke song?

It's not the most impressive song but it's "Kiss Me" by Sixpence None the Richer. I feel very comfortable singing that one. I am always a bit worried: "What if I sing a song and it's going to be in a different range."

Have you covered it during a show?

During the pandemic, I was a Twitch music streamer for a brief period of time. I basically went to school to study music therapy. I was a music therapist for maybe three years. Then, the pandemic hit and all of my contracts were put on pause. I was working in elderly homes and they were closed to anyone who wasn't a full-time salary position for the CLSC or any kind of CHSLD. I was also working with adults with multiple disabilities in day centers. Those were put on pause as well because they couldn't ensure safe adapted transportion where germs wouldn't be shared or anything like that. I was running music therapy groups. For a brief time, I became a Twitch music streamer so that I could like feel like I had something to practice for, to keep up with my music a little bit. I feel very motivated by external goals. If I have something to practice for then, I will do it and it will be great. That was actually my first taste of what a community could be like. I did feel like I find a little community through Twitch; regulars who would show up. I had a discord channel and I felt like some kind of separation; I was the performer and they were the listeners. It was a different community but a community nonetheless; one I wasn't expecting.

Would you ever consider streaming again?

I would consider it but it's just a little tougher now because I work a 9 to 5 full-time job. I am not doing music therapy in my current job. It's just about finding the time to do it. I am open to the opportunity. It would be even better if I could find other people to hop in and do that with me because I do enjoy collaborating. It makes me a bit more anxious to have other musicians depend on me. I also feel a little bit more nervous when I know that if I mess up then, it will impact someone else. When it's just me, I feel a lot more at peace. If I make a mistake, it will only impact me.

If you are a repeated customer (it sounded funny in my head), then you know exactly where this conclusion will go. I know my interviews tend to be longer than my other articles so thank you for taking the time to read them. It means the world to me. It also means a lot to the artists and bands who share so much with me during our exchanges. If you have read this interview carefully, then you know Ziying doesn't have music on streaming platforms just yet. However, you can give her a follow on Instagram (link below). If you are in the Montreal area, see her perform if you can.  Once again, thank you! Thank you to Ziying for your insightful and honest answers. 

Your tiny and often tired but hopefully still favourite interviewer,

Ariane

Useful links to further discover and support Ziying

Ziying's Instagram